2012-12-02
2012-12-10
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, it sounded like house speaker john boehner is in wait and see mode. this is something else he said and get your take on the other side. take a listen. >> if the president doesn't agree with our proposal i agree he has an obligation to families and small businesses to offer a plan of his own. a plan that can pass both chambers of the congress. >> so the president a's plan may not be able to pass the house at this point, but he's been out making his case to the american public, having dinner yesterday with a middle class family in virginia. vice president biden doing something similar today. what does the president hope to accomplish with visits like that and photo opes like this. >> this is a movie where we have a spoiler alert where we know the ending here. it goes one of two ways. we have taxes go up for everyone or the rich. president obama is making it clear to john boehner who aappears to be anyway public denial to try to stall time to prevent that from happening. >> is that the goal whether he comes out and has press conferences like that, is he posturing? what is he doing, if the end

is going to give and what his client's not going to give. we all know john boehner. john boehner's a deal maker. i didn't -- i liked him personally, but i never trusted him in congress because, you know, he liked making deals. that's what we need right now. the president can only push him so far. or he loses his caucus. and this is not about john boehner kicking and screaming. this is about him knowing what he can deliver. >> i understand that. john boehner has, and eric cantor and a paul ryan problem, he's got to keep them on board as his key guys. he can only go so far. i would guess that they're the ones holding the pen when he wrote, "i will not raise rates" in that letter he sent to president obama. but the problem is, we can agree or disagree with the president's position. i honestly take the president at his word. i do not believe there will be a deal here without some increase in tax rates for the top 2%. it doesn't have to be all of it, but some of it. i think the president has changed his tune a bit from the way he's handled some of these other negotiations. and take everything

. speaker john boehner meets this morning with house republicans who are angry at his new pitch to raise $800 billion in tax revenue in the fiscal cliff negotiations. president obama has said there will be no deal unless taxes are raised on the wealthiest americ americans. but staunch conservatives don't want any kind of new taxes. that's where speaker boehner's job gets really tough. on piers morgan tonight newt gingrich said if all else fails, go over the cliff. >> i think that no deal is better than a bad deal. i think going off this cliff is less dangerous than letting things build up for a year or two years to an even bigger cliff. i think that the president clearly has staked out a position of nonseriousness. and i think that it's very difficult for the house republicans right now to find any practical way to get his attention. so, he just won an election. he is feeling very good about himself. he is posturing brilliantly, putting the republicans in a corner. they need to relax. they don't have an election until november 2014. >> senior congressional correspondent dana bash joins m

to an agenda or an ideology. i applaud like charlie gaerino barack obama's suess, john boehner's success, came in humble beginnings, but neither one of us are doing us a favor. neither one of them are deserving of hero worship in a country falling apart. >> i didn't think we should be hero worshipping the president, what i said he's an admirable man that did great things. >> se, absolutely. >> in this country. i don't agree with his agenda. >> you argue that we haven't lost, to dagen's point we have it in us, but we haven't shown it? >> the lawmakers in washington don't, they're a bunch of gutless weasels who don't-- >> that language there. >> furthermore it's not productive language. >> well, they're not productive, and cticizing me for calling them gutless when that's exactly what they are. >> i'm trying to draw a distinction between-- >> come on. the gutless weasels on the one hand and not doing a good enough job on the other hand, let's cheer them on anday we honor your service, no do a better job. >> yeah i got cheered when i didn't unload the dishwasher when i was a kid instead sent to t

york. john boehner's back is against the wall and president obama is holding all the cards. this is "the ed show." let's get to work. >>> the clock is ticking. christmas is coming. the goose is getting fat. why are you not bringing this to the floor? >> an urgent message from nancy pelosi. but it's casual friday for speaker boehner. >> this isn't a progress report bauds there's no progress to report. >> today's news, speaker boehner and president obama will be the only two at the table to make a deal. i'll ask emanuel cleaver if boehner can get it done. >>> 33 months of private sector job growth. now is the time to start spending on jobs. david cay johnston is here. >>> the filibuster is more than an embarrassing blunder. bernie sanders explains why. >>> the right to work in michigan has ignited a fire storm with workers. we'll have the latest on rick snider's race to the bottom. >>> and breaking news from the supreme court. there will be a decision on the constitutionality of same-sex marriage. law professor jonathan terly has all the details. >> thanks for watching. john

. the president has said here is what i'm offering. listening to those clips of john boehner and listening to the congresswoman, all of those talking points sound very familiar. they sound a lot like the arguments that mitt romney was making during the campaign that americans roundly rejected. for them to cling to that rhetoric doesn't make sense. they've had time to make their case and they're losing american people. the president has been very firm from the beginning, he's been very consistent across the board with members of congress, the business community, progressive leaders, you name it, all the different folks he's brought in to talk about this, he's been very consistent. he's not playing a game and i think you got a taste of that yesterday in his remarks to the business roundtable. he's not kidding. he's put some serious things on the table, he's put his plans out there, it's balanced, there's spending, he's willing to make a deal but he is not willing to have any kind of conversation that does not include raising rates and he's unwilling to put raising the debt ceiling in as part

me. >> good to be here. >> david so house speaker john boehner says there's no progress to report. the white house says republicans are to blame for dragging their feet. it seems at least publicly we're getting nowhere. is there anything bigger churning behind the scenes? >> alex, i wish i had good news for you. there's not much going on. certainly at the staff level there's still talks going on. the president did have an onization with john boehner. both sides publicly at least are blaming the others for delaying here. i think both sides are said we know what we want to do, which is for the white house raise rates on the rich. but what can they talk about behind the scenes when the republicans are saying we don't want to do that, on the flip side the white house is saying they don't want to do the republican idea of just capping loop holes at least right now. they want to do that next year with a broader tax reform debate. right now there's not a lot to talk about. the president is going on the road again to detroit on monday and continue his public relations campaign on this to

. the president is going to be president for the next four years, john boehner is likely to be president f-- speaker for for years. but the president needs john boehner more than john boehner needs the president. >> does the speaker have enough votes inside his caucus to agree to some kind of tax rate hike in the upper echelons of society, does he have enough votes that he can put together with whatever nancy pelosi can stir up and pass it? >> i'm not sure there's support for rate hike, there is support for the revenue by cleaning up the tax code. >> isn't there $800 billion of collected revenue still a tax hike? >> this has been part of the debate for years. looking at cleaning up the code. and candy, getting in there and -- there are so many ways you can do it. maybe you want to cap total deductions, maybe you want to look at some of these tax credits and clean this code up. dave campus p dave's camp has put an incredible amount of time on this. it is the time, this is the opportunity to clean that code up. >> if we don't act before the end of the year, taxes go up for everybody, not for

. president and house speaker john boehner met today at the white house. we're not getting details yet as to how those negotiations went, except to stay that the lines of communications remained open. both sides of the fiscal cliff negotiations are much closer than you may think despite what law makes say publicly. jackie calms of the "new york times" picked up on something that lawmaker tim cole said recently. >> the republicans should just declare victory and taking the 98% of the tax cuts that they agree on and work next year on tax reform and see if they can't get the top rate back down again. it's hard to think that that's not where they're going to end up so why not make it clean instead of ugly. >> i think it's true that many people are saying privatery what tom cole said publicly on the show. but they believe that the politically right thing to do right now is to cut that you are losses, let tax rates go up for the most wealthy and really try for significant tax reform so that 39.6% is going to be mute. >> so the good news is that negotiations do continue, there was a meeting t

. is this john boehner's caucus? is it eric cantor's caucus? negotiating with john boehner when he doesn't control things is not tenable for the white house, not tenable for john boehner. >> well, i guess in the beltway here where i am tonight and the micro, it's cantor or boehner, but the bigger picture, if the president succeeds in terming the country around on this whole obsession with protecting the rich and protecting no tax cuts, that's a big moment. possible transformative moment in where we are in american politics. krystal ball and richard wolffe, thanks for your time this evening. >> thank you, reverend. >> be sure to catch krystal on "the cycle" weekdays at 3 p.m. right here on msnbc. >>> ahead, he tried to get attention with a disasterous soup kitchen op, and now he wants to rebrand himself as someone who cares about the poor. we reveal paul ryan's makeover plans. and more on the box republicans are in and president obama's power play. senator barbara boxer of california joins me on that. >>> plus, it's the gop's worst nightmare come true. here comes elizabeth warren on the b

with virtually nothing. >> distinctly unhappy house speaker john boehner on fox news yesterday. meanwhile, the white house put out a statement today arguing the republican plan lowers tax rates for the wealthy and quote, sticks the middle class with the bill. so with 29 days to go until the fiscal cliff, what would it take to get a deal? joining me now, men on opposite sides, grover norquist, president of americans for tax reform and robert reish, former secretary of labor for president bill clinton and the author of "beyond outrage." none of the three of us are beyond outrage, grover norquist, which is why i keep having you back. the situation it seems to me as an impartial observer here is that both sides have now made fairly ludicrous offers that they know the other side is never going to accept in a million years. that does beg the question, grover, why bother, given that both sides know where they need to move, why the games? >> well, it's not clear that both sides know. the week after the election, president obama was asked do you have to have the higher rates or could we have deduc

. >> going know where just 28 days left. >> i feel almost sorry for john boehner. >> does john boehner have control of his caucus? >> will john boehner lead his sdmaukz. >> is he leading his caucus or will his caucus lead him? >> two party two is going to dwarf tea party one. >> this is embarrassing. >> he's the problem. >> he's willing to act like the election never happened. >> we're not getting anywhere. >> we're going over the cliff. >> it's the gop who has been short on specifics. >> i would say we're nowhere, period. we're nowhere. >> the same exact policies. >> this shows that republicans are really chicken hawks. >> you can't be serious. >> chicken hawks when it comes to reducing the debt. >> get serious. >> we're not getting anywhere. >> the path to nowhere. >> be prepared for the plunge. >> i would say we're know where know where. >> there's clearly a chance. >>> today, john boehner, eric cantor and paul ryan finally kind of sort of responded to the president's budget proposal, a proposal of their own that they were so unmarried to that they didn't put their names on it. they said

this before, balance is in the eye of the beholder. john boehner would say this is a balanced approach, we're putting revenue on the table as well as entitlement cuts. president obama seems to be indicating balance means getting more from the wealthy and likely to mean raising rates. as he said today and prior to today, the math doesn't add up if you simply close loopholes, cap deductions, do those sorts of things. we're sort of where we always have been. it's where we have been for several years at least when it relates to congress and the president simply not being able to resolve what are fundamental differences. we talked about this before the election, andrea. the election was supposed to tell us something about what the american public wanted. president obama did win the election. you know, an event has happened as part of the many months where the public comes down on this. >> luke russert, john boehner did yesterday come out with their proposal, the house proposal. is that a nonstarter or move the ball a little bit? >> i would say it's a nonstarter for the white house, but it moves

's when severe tax hikes and cuts in spending begin. according to the "new york times," john boehner has asked democratic leaders to step aside so he and the president can attempt to negotiate a deal one-on-one and no one is objecting. paul steinhauser is live from washington. paul, you got some new polling for us. what do americans want to see in a deal? >> it's interesting what they want to see and what they don't want to see. one of the biggest sticking points between democrats and republicans over averting the fiscal cliff is raising taxes on those making over $250,000 a year. look at this from quinnipiac university, the question was asked are you okay with that? 65% say they support such a move to avert the fiscal cliff. this is the third poll over the last two weeks to show the same thing, that most americans are okay with raising those taxes on incomes over $250,000 a year. go to the next screen, there's a partisan divide here. this explains why most republicans are dead set against this. democrats are fine with that move. independents as well. but only a minority of republicans a

. john boehner gained strong backing of the house gop. they actually say that the speaker's more powerful today than he has been since he became speaker two years ago. >> well, that's exactly the opposite of what we were discussing on the set yesterday with matt lewis. >> yeah. i guess one question is, is that story there for a purpose, which is to make him appear stronger, and also, is he strong in relation to the offer that's on the table, which is an offer that does not reflect compromise yet? >> well, he is strong, i think, as long as he's not seen as bowing down and caving in to the president. i will tell you, there are conservatives dair a s -- erick who is trying to get him removed as speaker, saying they only need 16 votes to drive john boehner out of time. >> that's kind of my point. >> a situation described as very fluid. >> how many degrees of freedom does he have from where he is now and who's holding the pen when they sign those letters? >> yeah, i don't think he's got a lot of freedom. harold, what do you think? >> i hope he stays strong for the simple reason that if and whe

that make up the difference. bill: john boehner will speak later this hour. we'll see how he responds to that comment. if washington can't get a deep, automatic tax increases and massive spending cuts do take effect. martha: west virginia senator joe manchin, a democrat discussing the fiscal cliff, social security within medicare. he believes they must be run more efficiently. >> last year the office of budget management says $115 billion was misspent. that's a tremendous savings right there. they are both much lower than everyone says we need. all economists say we need a minimum of $4 trillion or greater swing. that means a combining of many things. i think both of them are in the two or not much more than two or lower than two. that only goats you halfway there. i don't know how we got off track of what we really need to fix this. martha: he argues the economy is ready to take off if people would just stop playing the blame game. bill: one of the changes that may be coming is the reduction in the mortgage interest rate duck you can claim. but according to the i.r.s. only a small pe

, in the words of speaker john boehner, we need to find common ground here, and we need to do it quick. >> there ain't going to be any between these two ties, my man. over here, good news, jon meacham will be number one on "the new york times" best-seller list this weekend. >> hear, hear. >> his book, "jefferson." bad news is he's going to get there wearing that tie with bunny rabbits on it. here they are. could we get a text poll? >> can i just tell you, i got this from harold ford. >> that explains a lot. >> so there you go. >> that means it's free at both ends. >> it's a disgrace to michael steele who dresses so well each and every day. >> look, i just show up and play, baby. that's it. >> you're doing a good job with that. >> got the pocket square. steele's going for if. >> congratulations on the book. >> thank you. >> going gangbusters. >> thank you. it's been fun. i've been out talking to folks, and everybody's been really, really nice. >> why are people so thrilled? i'm not saying this to give you crap. >> i can tell. >> why are people so thrilled by thomas jefferson? >> i think

, no one's going to remember john boehner's name, no one's going to remember harry reid's name, no one's going to believe 20 seconds from now that john boehner and harry reid were the architects of any deal or any failure. when does the president realize that he is sitting in the chair of thomas jefferson, of abraham lincoln, of woodrow wilson, t.r., fdr, jfk, ronald reagan. when does he realize that and step up and start doing what abraham lincoln did? >> yeah. >> and buy them off, charm them off, beat them up. >> build a bridge to nowhere. >> build a bridge. when is he going to do that? >> you know, what puzzles me about this is that he knows all that lincoln history. he didn't need to go to the movie to learn that's how lincoln operated. >> and he loved to cast himself as a new lincoln. but his inability to work with democrats and republicans -- listen friends at home watching, not just republicans, democrats and republicans, you have to go back to jimmy carter to find a president that was viewed with as much suspicion by his own party on the hill. >> his own party. >> -- as barack

stand because we heard from john boehner he wants to meet with the president and none of the plans coming from the white house so far, the opening bid at least, would pass either house. the president went to the business roundtable and said, don't even think about using the debt ceiling. but he can't really control that, can he? >> no. not really. i still think we're in the positioning stage of this. president obama made very clear yesterday i think to the extent there's news that was made yesterday i think in the bloomberg interview where he reiterated the fact you can't simply get to the debt on the wealthiest americans. that is still the stopping point, the hurdle in this back and forth and, you know, john boehner for what republicans have given -- you've seen some breaks in the ranks, more than the democratic side, you've not seen really anyone with the exception of tom coburn from oklahoma say, okay, let's raise the rates, move forward. so we're still kind of at that impasse and that's not changed. >> and despite the fact that senator kerry was offended by our referring to 201

with lawrence o'donnell. have a great night. >>> we don't know what john boehner said to the president on the phone today, but we do know that boehner is finally admitting defeat on one thing. the rich will have to pay more. >> the next 72 hours are critical. >> will republicans cry uncle? both sides are still locked in a stalemate. >> there's plenty of hot rhetoric to go around. >> both sides are coming out swinging. . >> raising tax rates will hurt the economy. >> i will not play that game. >> president obama standing his ground. >> i will not play that game. >> he's not willing to play that game. >> playing the smackdown. >> i think the president has boxed the republicans in. >> i know we have it to raise revenue. >> is he the only republican? >> i don't care how we do it. >> raising tax rates hurt the economy. >> let's just go over the [ bleep ] cliff. >> if they do not make this deal on tax rates for the top 2%, then they're going away. >> i just hope this doesn't become a game of chicken. >> i will not play that game. >> it goes into february and march. >> public opinion is on th

to date. president obama, house speaker john boehner breaking the ice. >> that's good news, right? >> the two leaders discussing the fiscal cliff by telephone yesterday. no word of significant progress with just 26 days remaining to get a deal done. but there are signs of compromise. oak e oklahoma's republican senator breaking ranks, saying he's okay with raising taxes on the rich. >>> two seizures off the coast of the dominican republic last month, authorities recovering more than 50 bails of coke. it is weighing close to two tons. the drugs had a street value of $45 million. it will now be destroyed. >> are you losing your keys or misplacing your wallet. >> yes. >> there may be a quarter-sized blue tooth enabled button to communicate with a smart phone. >> sneakers, that's hysterical. >> the app will have a radar feature if they're getting warmer or colder. >> my blackberry charger. that's what i need it for. >> it just has to tell you where it is. >>> a sticky situation on a highway. in new hampshire, a tractor-trailer loaded with a cargo of maple syrup overturned on the inter

for his analysis on that. martha: the fiscal cliff, president obama and house speaker john boehner set to have a face-to-face meeting, one-on-one. we're waiting to hear from speaker boehner in just about 50 minutes away now. we'll bring you that live. bill: also, it has been 40 years, four full decades since the last man stepped on the moon. that was an american. his name is gene cernan. we'll talk to hem this hour. the last person to see the moon's craters up close and personal. >> ♪ i was stroeling on the moon one day, in a merry, merry of month of -- december. >> may, may. ♪ much to my surprise a pair of eyes, -- >> this is a neat way to travel. [ female announcer ] food, meet flavor. flavor, meet food. it's time for swanson flavor boost. concentrated broth in easy to use packets. mix it into skillet dishes, for an instant dose of... hell-o! [ female announcer ] get recipes at flavorboost.com. bill: we now have a verdict for a bus driver on trial for manslaughter. it will be revealed this morning although the verdict was reached yesterday because a juror had to leave the courtho

it's not going to make a big difference on the negotiations between the white house and john boehner because i don't see much progress there. i think boehner, even though in control of his kau tus, doesnca have a lot of negotiating room because of the tooe party. >> do you think mr. boehner will be glad to see the end of mr. demint. >> i'm sure he will. i think it represents the weakens of the tea party within congress. jim demint is a movement conservative. we have certainly not seen nor heard the last of him. he will find other ways to create headaches for both boehner and mcconnell, but i agree with david. most importantly, it may be a slight relief from the headache for john boehner, but he's still got a big challenge in that he is negotiating at this point with himself and not facing the reality that he doesn't really have a lot of leverage. >> indeed. jared, speaking of the details themselves, speaker boehner is saying that his is a serious offer that produces sufficient revenue and savings for the next decade. you're an economist, does it? do his numbers really add up? >> well

battle facing this man republican house speaker john boehner within his own party. as he tries to negotiate a deal do avoid that fiscal cliff. >>> time now is 6:08. let's check in with tara. what are you keeping an eye on? >> in san francisco we have issues actually with some backup. spinout near hospital suffer on 101 southbound and there are several cars that are in the fast lane and definitely having an impact on traffic. right now let's take a look at our maps. we can show you where we have other accidents brewing here. 280 northbound. and then we have flooding in the two right hand lanes. so be aware of that. and then if we head over to the oakland care you can -- oakland area we have slowing through the richmond area. we also have this accident still being cleared here at buchanan street and a stalled truck on 24 near the caldecott tunnel. if we take a live look at the bay bridge toll plaza, we have a lot of rain out there. the metering lights are on. you're looking at an extra 15 minutes to get into san francisco. here's a look at highway 24 live. that stalled truck coul

this country stronger. >> right. again, you know where this is going. john boehner, again, speaker, said we're at a stalemate. is that how you would describe where things are? >> i think we're far apart still, but i think we're moving closer together. again, remember -- >> where are you closer? >> the republicans have said for the first time in decades, if i'm not mistaken, the leaders of the republican party, that they are prepared to raise taxes as part of a deal that helps reduce our long term deficit. what they haven't said is how far they're willing to go on rates and revenues, and that's what we need to see from them. >> they said no increased rates. >> but that's -- but they know this. there's not going to be an agreement without rates going up. there's not -- >> you'll go off the fiscal cliff if the republicans say, sorry, no way are we going to raise rates for the -- on the wealthy. you guys are willing to go off -- >> if republicans are not willing to let rates go back up and we think they should go back to the clinton levels, the time when the american economy was doing exception

the weekend house speaker john boehner said these negotiations are nowhere. jay carney disagrees with that assessment. now phone calls at this point between president obama and congressional leaders, but the white house says the talks will be ongoing over the next several days, tamron. >> thank you. the president's q and a on twitter comes days after republicans flat-out rejected his opening bid in negotiations. house speaker john boehner appeared on one sunday morning talk show to see the president's proposal was not in his opinion a proposal at all. >> i was flabbergasted and said, you can't be serious. i just have never seen anything like it. we have seven weeks between election day and the end of the year, and three of those weeks have been wasted with this nonsense. >> okay. >> treasury secretary tim geithner appeared on five separate sunday morning talk shows. he says it's the gop who have been short on specifics. >> we said how and how much and who should pay. they haven't proposed what they think. >> joining me now is california congressman karen bass. thank you for your

very surreal. >>> the relationship between president obama and house speaker john boehner can sometimes seem tense and awkward, so snl decided to try and explain it. >> in order to get the support of the speaker, i agreed there would be no tax increases, i repeat, zero tax increases. why would i do that? i mean i won the election. i had the leverage, why give in? well, simply put, i felt sorry for this man. early this week, i found my way into the congressional cafeteria, and what do i see? john boehner, sitting by himself. all alone. not a single member of his party willing to share his company. he didn't even have any milk to drink because, well, tell them why, john? >> they had taken my milk and thrown it in the garbage. >> these are supposed to be his friends and colleges. tell them what your so called friends did to your office desk? >> it was a rubber snake. >> a rubber snake. and did it scare you? >> it did. >> i was so heart broken to hear this, i said look, how about this, john. if you agree to a 1% raise on the top two americans, just two people, i will dissolve social securit

the fiscal cliff crisis. they will also meet with john boehner. boehner counter proposal yesterday. $600 billion in cuts in entitlement and $250 billion in changes in way the government changes inflation that would impact social security. let me bring in the national journal from the editor. good morning. i want to talk to you about this republican proposal saying republicans in congress want to get serious about asking the wealthiest to pay slightly higher tax rates. we won't be able to achieve a significant balanced approach to the deficit. it does have some revenue in it, even though it's not from tax increases. so what does this opening offer say about where we are in these negotiations? >> well, it seems very difficult to imagine that we're going to be getting to a deal that will handle everything that needs to be addressed before the end of the year. i think the first main thing that needs to be addressed is the question of the tax cuts expiring. and for the obama administration, the question is, is it in their interest to trade tax cuts for the wealthy? increase for the wealthy fo

come on the n.f.l. murder suicide. any moment now, house speaker john boehner will light the capitol christmas tree. yes, it's still called a christmas tree. enjoy it while can. this is temporary set. ♪ ♪ [ male announcer ] with 160 more miles per tank, the distances aren't getting shorter. ♪ the trucks are going farther. the new 2013 ram 1500. ♪ with the best-in-class fuel economy. engineered to move heaven and earth. ♪ guts. glory. ram. share "not even close." share "you owe me..." share "just right." the share everything plan. shareable data across 10 devices with uimited talk and text. by htc for $49.99. >> dana: back with more on the murder-suicide we talked about in the "a" block. we'll talk about the possible underlying factors of the violence. listen to rush limbaugh. >> might there have been a better outcome if there had been a marriage involved between mr. belcher and his girlfriend? i don't know.l i know is that it the statistics from single parenthood and children out of wedlock and what happens to kids in those circumstances, what happens to the fathers in thos

a threat when i hear one and so does john boehner and the so-called tea party stripping for lawmakers of their committee assignments. now he's facing a new threat from the tea party. today demint also said that democrats weren't the problem. the problem was actually with republicans and control of our message and our ideas senator demint and now that's a scary thought. joining me now is former congressman, a democrat from virginia and joe madison and nationally syndicated host thank you both for being here tonight. >> thank you. >> congressman, let me start with you. senator demint starts about firing speaker boehner on rush limbaugh show. where is this war going? >> well, you do see a real split on the republican side right now between the establishment figures. let's be clear, the power still sits with the tea party more than with the establishment. you've seen this in the picking of the next gubernatorial candidate. and so it's a small number of people who are trying to move away from that ideology and you also see the institutional shift. something like the heritage foundation tha

for four years, john boehner is like i to be speaker for four years. so this is the first part of a relationship that will stretch for years. they need each other to succeed. >> does the speaker have enough votes inside his caucus to agree to some kind of tax rate hike in the upper echelons of society? the high wage earners? does he have those votes that he can put together with whatever nancy pelosi can stir up and pass it? >> i'm not sure there is support for the rate hikes. there is support for revenue, by cleaning up the code. >> can you tell me what the difference is? isn't $800 billion in collected revenue still a tax hike? >> there are so many things, and this has been part of the debate for years. looking at cleaning up the code. and candy, getting in there, and there are so many ways you can do it. maybe you want to cap total deductions, maybe you want to look at some of these tax credits and clean this code up. dave camp put an incredibility amount of time into this. he and kevin brady have worked on this. it is the time -- this is the opportunity to clean that code u

page. you have that proposal put forward by speaker john boehner that calls for $800 billion in new tax revenue, but some conservatives think that republicans are giving up too much. take a listen. >> republicans should not be conceding that the federal government needs more money, negotiating with ourselves and treating the president's proposal like it's serious. >> look, i support the speaker and we're actually not very far apart on anything. you know at the end of the day, he has to negotiate a deal. if there is an area we do agree with the president on, that is 98% of the american people getting about 80% of this tax cut shouldn't have their taxes raised. my suggestion was let's take the one area we agree and take it off the table. >> now later this morning, president obama will be speaking and taking questions at the business round table meeting, a white house official saying that the president will make the case that middle-class americans need certainty that their taxes will not go up at the end of the year. he will also make the case that this fiscal cliff will have a negative i

, according to the republicans, unserious, it flabbergasted the speaker of the house, john boehner. though tim geithner went out yesterday and said, that plan that we're pushing? it's a good one. here he is. >> we think that's a very good set of proposals. we think that's what's good fort economy. if they've got different suggestions, they want to go further in some areas, they should lay it out to us. >> i think we're going over the cliff. it's pretty clear to me they've made a political calculation. this offer doesn't remotely deal with entitlement reform in a we to save medicare and medicaid and social security from imminent bankruptcy. it raises $1.6 trillion on job creators that will destroy the economy and there are no spending controls. i'm serious about revenue. you can limit deductions to 40 or $50,000 a person, which takes care of the middle class, upper income americans will lose their deductions and raise about 800 billion dollars in revenue. but i'll only do that if we do entitlement reform and the president's plan, when it comes to entitlement reform is just quite frankly, a joke

of john boehner and plan. those tea party-backed conservatives say this is something that would help job growth. clearly what we're seeing here is republicans are not speaking with one voice. >> republicans should not be conceding that the federal government needs more money, negotiating with ourselves and treating the president's proposal like it's serious. >> we do agree that 8% of the american people are getting about 80% of this tax cut shouldn't have their taxes raised. my suggestion was let's take the one area we agree and take it off the table. >> but zoraida, as you saw there from the president earlier in that bloomberg interview, he is digging in, saying there can't be a deal unless upper income americans pay more. middle-class americans should get the bush era tax cut extension. is he not backing down from that at all. the president saying in that interview that he's not being stubborn. he's not being partisan but rather that it's, quote, a matter of math. >> we've been talking now for a while that americans blame republicans if a deal doesn't go through. new polling shows amer

the massive tax hikes and spending cuts. congress breaking in a week for the holiday. so john boehner trying to simplify things. he's asking top democrats and republica republicans to step aside so he can negotiate with the president one-on-one. it seems to be a request that everyone was able to live with. brianna keilar is live for us at the white house. if this is the case that everybody has been cleared out of the room, does that surprise you? it seems to make sense to me. >> reporter: it's not surprising at all. this is what observers of this process thought would happen all along. ultimately this was a process that would come down to president obama and house speaker john boehner brokering a deal. very much the way you saw they attempted to do during the debt ceiling debacle last year. it simplifies the problem of less cooks in the kitchen. then they will have to sell it. president obama would have to bring in democrats. john boehner would have to bring in his republicans and make sure everyone is on board. this comes on the heels of what has really been radio silence between the white

in the phone call between speaker of the house john boehner and president of the united states, barack obama. did they come to a conclusion. it is now the president's turn. >> brian: it is a week since the president and speaker talked. i do not know at of this moment who called who. >> steve: we know no details. >> brian: it is good there is no details. i just talked to the president and he's not listening to me . i talked to the speaker and he dug in. that is a good sign. >> steve: keep in mind, the last offer on the table was made by the republicans. the republicans are waiting for a counter offer. the white house said that is not serious, we are waiting for a offer from the republicans. tim geithner was on cnbc yesterday and asked whether or not the federal government is preparing to go off the fiscal cliff in particular this administration. he answered unfortunately in the affirmative. here's tim. >> if republicans do not agree to that is the administration prepared to go over the fiscal cliff. >> we face no prospect of agreement that doesn't involve the rates going up on the top two per

closer together? >> reporter: there are two important signs today. speaker, house speaker john boehner met with president obama at the. we don't know how long they met or exactly what they talked about, but the white house says lines of communication are open and face-to-face meeting is on important. at the same time republicans say they will accept the demands for higher taxes on the wealthy if it goes along with spending cuts entitlements like medicare and social security. listen.... >> a lot of people are putting forth a theory. i think it has merit where you give the president 2% increase he is talking about on the top 2 percent. i am beginning to believe that is the best route for us to take. >> reporter: many other republicans, of course, standing firm against any tax increase. they could give the speaker a hard time if he tries to pass the kind of legislation corker was talking about there. >> and how are the democrats reacting to accept the higher tax rates? >> reporter: they are happy to see movement was made toward the president's position but speaker boehner has not embraced

in additional spending, what part of this plan is a balanced or bipartisan approach? >> i bet john boehner things the grand bargain was good deal last year. the chicken question is john boehner having to blink. president was able to get $1.6 trillion because it's coming from the increase on wealthy americans. we don't want 98% of americans tax rates to go up in the name of saving tax rates for the wealthy. so that is going to increase on wealthy americans, 60% of americans overwhelmingly support. the president won this election fair and square. american voters are clear on the mandate and support an increase in tax rates to balance this budget. >> that is not true. for the bush tax cuts to expire and top 2 percent even most generous estimate that is $90 billion more in revenue. not $1.6 trillion more in revenue even over ten years. even if you accept that larger number, the deficit is $1.5 trillion so, even if the republicans raise the you are giving $90 billion. where are you going to get the rest of it? it will have to come from entitlement reform and meaning spending cuts. >> it's comin

with the president, house speaker john boehner says the white house is stone walling. >> when it comes to the fiscal cliff that's threatening our economy and threatening jobs, the white house is has wasted another week. >> reporter: this morning in his weekly address, president obama is holding a hard line on raising rates for the wealthy. >> and if we're serious about protecting middle-class families, then we're also going to have to ask the wealthiest americans to pay higher tax rates. that's one principle i won't compromise on. >> reporter: but how much higher could be the key. the top tax rate is set to rise from 35% to 39.6% on january 1st. when asked if a middle ground could be found, both boehner and biden showed some wiggle room. >> the top brackets have to go up. it's not a negotiable issue. theoretically we can negotiate how far up. >> reporter: at another local restaurant, the owner has seen enough of washington gridlock. >> i wish those lawmakers would get their [ bleep ] together and get it done and try to help everybody. it would be good if they could do it before the holidays are over

republican front man house speaker john boehner is sending the white house a message that the president's no more mr. nice guy approach is the wrong approach. >> i think they won the election, must have foregotten republicans continue told the majority in house to. but, the president's idea of a negotiation is roll over and do what i ask. we need to find common ground and we need to find it quickly. >> top republicans used words like stalemate and nowhere to go describe the current state of play. others within their party are taking it one step further telling americans they should be prepared for the punch. >> i thank the president and tim geithner for re-energizing the republican caucus. >> i think we're going over the cliff. it's pretty clear to me they made a political calculation. >> with both sides looking like they are dig in but cementing in and the calendar page ticking down what does it take to play let's make a deal. >> let's see how big yours is versus mine in the earnings of their plans. >> everybody should just go to sleep, wake up on december 14th when there's about a wee

joins me now. senator mitchell, you more or less have been in john boehner's shoes. you were a congressional leader hammering out a tax and spending cut deal with the president of the opposing party. how is what we're seeing now different than what you experienced two decades ago? >> it's similar in terms of the issues, the positions of the parties have been that way for a long time. it's different in several respects. first, when i was there, it was the president who had made the no tax pledge. president bush the first, as you'll recall, made a very famous no tax pledge which he eventually backed off of. in this case, it's the congress. the republicans of the congress specifically, who have made the tax pledge, and the president who is trying to get them to break it. secondly, the numbers are very much reflecting the passage of time. we were very concerned because we thought the budget was going to be -- the deficit was going to be about $150 billion. that shocked everyone into action. then, unlike now, there remains some degree of bipartisanship. there was comity, there was

and john boehner, when they can't be bothered to talk to each other. so what did you discover? let me start with you, governor herbert. what was your take on the two meetings? >> well, we were honored to be invited. i think too many times, the states and governors have been overlooked and underappreciated and almost a second thought when it comes to some policies made so i applaud jack's leadership in getting us together in a bipartisan way through the national governors association. i thought we were well received. i think the president and the speaker and majority leader was appreciative of our insight and our concerns about them going over the fiscal cliff. >> right, but i mean, jack markell, that's all very well, i'm glad you all got on so swimmingly but what is actually going to get done here? there are 28 days to go until we fall off this cliff and the american people are frankly sick and tired of waiting for a bunch of politicians to try and sort something out and just play politics, just get on with it. >> well, we had a productive conversation with the president and his team as wel

. we can't afford for the wealthiest 2% of americans. >> reporter: john boehner dug in. no rate rises on anyone. >> the president's idea of a negotiation is roll over and do what i ask. >> reporter: the opening bid brought the gop leaders by geithner is a nonstarter. >> i was flabbergasted. i looked at him and said, you can't be serious. >> reporter: included in the offer, $1.6 trillion in new revenue, twice what was on the table in last year's failed grand bargain, and $600 billion in spending cuts, much of it from medicare, not nearly good enough, say republicans who insist the president show more of his hand. >> the white house keeps spiking the ball on tax increases for the wealthy, but it's not yet been forthcoming on real entitlement reform. and without the two, there really is no deal. >> reporter: for now, the sides are far apart. >> what the chances we're going to go off the cliff? >> there's clearly a chance. >> reporter: with time running out, many on both sides say the time for posturing is over. >> at a certain point in time, we have to quit playing to the cheap seats in

republicans are split on john boehner's plan to avoid tax hikes all together and admit negotiations are going nowhere. >> nothing going on privately that's not going on publicly. >> reporter: republicans say the president needs to meet them halfway. >> he's got to be serious. he's offered more spending, more stimulus than offering any new cuts. >> reporter: and they insist there's good reason why people making over $250,000 a year should not pay more. >> when you raise tax rates, you're impacting the small businesses that create the jobs in this country. >> reporter: the back and forth is unsettling for the nation's governors, democrats and republicans came to washington tuesday with one message. >> you've got the to come together and get this done. >> reporter: and better do it quickly because we hit the cliff in 27 days. >> the clock is ticking. tracie potts in washington. thanks. >>> overseas now where more massive anti-government protests are occurring in egypt today. the demonstrators say the rallies are a last warning to president morsi over his seizure of almost unrestricted power. and

president spoke by telephone with house speaker john boehner. no specifics on what they said to each other, but it was their first conversation in a week. eventually the two sides will get down to bargaining over specifics, including entitlements. one idea may be to change the way the government measures inflation. that may sound like a small change, but, as darren gersh reports, it could have a big impact. >> reporter: if the price of oranges goes up, consumers will buy apples and other cheaper foods. we know that. economists call that switching "substitution," but that change in bevior doesn't show up in the official inflation rate. so most economists think the current consumer price index overstates the actual cost of living. that's important because the inflation rate is used to set tax brackets and social security benefits. moving to a more accurate inflation measure called the "chained c.p.i." would cut the deficit by $200 billion over ten years. supporters say the change wouldn't cut benefits. >> if we're making the change to reflect what is the real cost of living, as opposed to a

on chiapitol hill which is why so many have gone home. we know that president obama and john boehner spoke by phone. republican sources telling us they had a conversation yesterday. we don't have a readout on what that was about. we don't know that if any meetings have been scheduled. but any small sign of progress is welcome here on capitol hill. now with so many lawmakers headed home and likely to face the ire of their constituents, we saw one protester in baltimore yesterday over social security. there are a few left. today there's a joint economic committee hearing. they're going to hear from a top economist not only about the jobs numbers coming out tomorrow but also about what can be done to avoid this issue at the end of the year. >> tracie potts for us in washington. thank you. >>> last night on the ed show, steny hoyer explains why he thinks the debt ceiling vote should be taken off the table. >> the debt ceiling is a phone y vote, frankly. and from time to time democrats have made it an item that they demagogue down and the republicans have demagogued on it, as well. the debt lim

up if speaker john boehner accepts ending tax breaks for people making more than $250,000 a year. >> what the president has said is we need $1.6 trillion as part of an overall deficit reduction plan, because if you don't get those additional revenues, but you also try and reduce the deficit, you end up whacking everybody else much harder. and so, it's really important to have that revenue number as high as possible. >> sure. >> look, the president's already been clear, ed. on cuts, he will continue to implement over the next ten years over $1 trillion in cuts that he agreed to as part of the budget control act, 100% cuts. and at the time, he said we've got to come back and do revenue. he "life & style weeklalso call billion in cuts and laid out exactly what those should be. >> catch "the ed show" here at 8:00 p.m. eastern on msnbc, the place for politics. >>> well, new jersey governor chris christie is making a personal plea for federal disaster aid in the wake of hurricane sandy. the republican governor paid an unannounced visit to the white house to ask the president for $83 bi

're at a standstill. now, house speaker john boehner is putting all the blame on president obama. he's upset that the white house quickly rejected boehner's plan. >> there are a lot of things that are possible to put the revenue that the president seeks on the table. none of it is going to be possible. the president insists on his position. insists on my way or the highway. >> president obama is asking congress for more than $60 billion for states affected by superstorm sandy. officials from states hardest hit say the money is just a start. with the fiscal cliff looming the staff is sure to face some resistance on capitol hill. >>> he spoke at this year's democratic national convention as an independent, but now former republican florida governor charlie crist is a proud democrat. crist posted a twitter photo friday showing his registration papers tweeting that he's proud and honored to join the party in the home of president obama. crist ran for the u.s. senate as an independent in 2010, but was defeated by marco rubio. some are speculating this move is in preparation for another run for go

, president obama and john boehner. we have not seen movement today or this weekend. >> mike viqueira at the white house. thank you. >>> new today, leaders from both sides agreeing the best option is to avoid the fiscal cliff. they can't agree on which path to take to get there. >>> i don't think republicans or americans want to raise any taxes just to continue this spending in washington. they want a more efficient and more accountable. what we are saying is we need to do what ronald reagan did with tip o'neill, show the leadership to get in the room. same as bill clinton did with newt gingrich. get in the room and make the changes that are needed. >> the president wants to solve the problem. it's what he said in the campaign. it's what he's saying now. we cannot lurch from one crisis to the other. think of all the times tea party republicans and speaker boehner threatened to shut down the government over the debt ceiling. listen, if we are going to have this certainty for businesses to invest and know new jobs are being created we have to get this behind us. >> joining me now, dana

. >>> coming up at the top of the hour on "morning joe," the term is herding cats. john boehner now facing backlash from his own party over the fiscal cliff proposal that he made with some saying it doesn't go far enough to fix the deficit. we'll break down what this means for negotiations ahead with our morning joe panel. but up next -- you never know who you'll see on a new york city subway. and for one kindly old lady, she literally did not know who she was seeing and sitting next to. we'll play her full conversation with jay-z when "way too early" comes right back. [ woman ] ring. ring. progresso. i just finished a bowl of your new light chicken pot pie soup and it's so rich and creamy... is it really 100 calories? let me put you on webcan... ...lean roasted chicken... and a creamy broth mmm i can still see you. [ male announcer ] progresso. you gotta taste this soup. time for citi price rewind. because your daughter really wants that pink castle thing. and you really don't want to pay more than you have to. only citi price rewind automatically searches for the lowest price. and if it

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